Welcome, brother. The water's not too bad, eh?

As a heretic the water is actually better. I didn't have to pay for it by pledging allegiance to some denominational creed or church. I had to work a little harder to find it for myself. But there were no strings attached.

Hi, I found your blog as you left a message on mine :) I would be interested in hearing what theological beliefs that led you to where you are now. That being said, I agree with you on denominations. Yet, God set up local congregations for a reason. I do not belong to an organized denomination but I do attend a non denominational congregation. I shall now go and read some of your posts :)

Be blessed,

tishrei - Glad to have you here. Let me answer your question very briefly here, but say that if you continue to come around you will find more and more depth to this brief explanation as I post more.

Anyway, I absolutely think we are meant to be in and part of a community. I think that community can take many forms.

For me that community can take place in a home, a coffee shop, the local park or wherever. A community doesn't even have to have a constant location. It could change with each meeting. It does not have to be centered around a "church building" whether it is denominational or non-denominational.

As a matter of fact in my opinion (just an opinion) I think more often than not most churches become so structured and organized that they stop being a community and become more like a business.

That's a start. Hopefully that gives you enough of an answer to determine whether or not you would like to keep visiting here to read more of my heretical ideas.

Hi, first I agree with you that it does not have to be a centered around a church building or the same place every time. But God did set up a structure, so to speak, in appointing pastors, etc. There is a flock and there is a shepherd of the flock. There is an accountability that goes with a certain type of structure.

I take issue with much of denominational churches. But I'm not ready to toss out the baby with the bath water (so to speak).

And yes, I will be back LOL.

tishrei - i would agree to the point that I think there needs to be a structure to an extent. However, from my study and reading I think the role of pastor as it is practiced today misses the mark.

I would go into more depth, but instead let me refer you to a website why I believe this far better than I could explain it myself. The blog is called 'The Assembling of the Church."

http://www.alanknox.net

There are several posts about pastors and their role on his blog. Really good stuff. Here is a link to one in particular. But if you are interested email him and let him know what you are looking for. He's a great guy and can probably point you to some of his other posts that reference the subject.

http://www.alanknox.net/2008/12/just-semantics-pastor/

Thank, I will go read his site. But I do want to mention one thing. The New Convenant is not a brand new religion (which you probably already know). All the new believers were Jews and understood it from a Jewish point of view. For as long as there was Israel, there was a structured corporate gathering (temple/synagogue). The feasts and gatherings were commanded by God. There was a structure with leaders. It's not that different with the corporate gathering of the church. There needs to be some sort of accountability with each other and that can't happen if a few people decide to meet for coffee and a bible study every so often.

Hey, you just gave me an idea for a topic :)

I can understand what you are saying, although I don't see it exactly that way. Even in those early days there was lots of Gentiles joining their ranks. That caused a lot disagreement and debate between Peter and Paul (and I'm sure others) as to how much of the established way should be retained.

But again, I would point you towards Alan's blog. He is doing his doctrinal dissertation on this whole subject. Very grounded and intelligent man.

By the way, I'm not saying that churches and pastors are bad and evil. I think most are led and attended by very sincere people. I just happen to think much of the methodology and structure as they exist now are counterproductive.

Hi again, and I'm speaking from my own perspective, not other Christians. I would be interested in hearing how it is counterproductive. That is NOT a challenge to you or towards you for I can probably add to where I believe it is counterprodutive if I thought about it. However, and this is MY thoughs, not speaking for others. I go to church not to learn for a weekly 1 hour sermon would not do it. I get a perspective at church but my time spent learning is not from church but through my own efforts (obviously with the guidance of the Holy Spirit), through taking to others such as even on your blog and this discussion, through reading and most important, time spent in His word. I have my own unique way of learning and that is to write out what I am studying -- that was how I started my blog for it kept me focused (I as really surprised it took off as I did not expect it to). My main purpose in going to church is corporate worship, fellowshipping with my brethern, a place where I am around only Christians, a time to rejunivate and fellowship, participate in the Lord's Supper. There really is a whole lot of reasons I go to services. I go to a very small congregation, and it is more in line with how the new churches worshipped as it is a messianic congegration. As long as it is theologically along the same lines as I believe (I would not go to a pentecostal congregation as I would have little in common), I do not take too much issue with them running it structurally different than I would if I were in charge (and I can't be charge since I am female).

I did read the post where you linked me to. I agree with him basically but I want to look at the word pastor and read his post a couple more times to take it in. Thanks for the link -- looks like a great site.

p.s. I'm happy to have found your blog. I will be reading it as you update it. Looks like you just started it but it looks like it's going to be a really good site to visit :)

First, I'm glad you liked Alan's blog. There is so much to learn there. I'm not saying I agree with everything he has ever written, but he has a really down to earth humble way to present things to make you think.

A good example of one of the ways I feel that the majority of modern churches are counterproductive is found on the post I just put up today called 'Stunted Growth'.

I spent well over 3 decades as part of 'the organized church' and what I wrote there was definitely true in my experience. Sadly, I think it is true of most churches.

I'll pass more along as time goes by. If you would like I have other things I have written on this topic that I could email to you sometime. They may eventually make it on this blog, but maybe not.

Just so you realize that I'm not completely anti-church I am a youth pastor at a church. It's the most unique church I have ever been part of, but still a church.

yes, I would like to receive those emails. I do not want to leave my email here due to email phishers. I sent a reply to you when you sent me a message on my blog. You should have my email address.

Hi, I left you a message earlier today and somehow it disappeared :( I wonder what happened. Basically all I said is I am looking forward to your next post. I have you on my feed.

tishrei - Thanks. I look forward to having the time to get something together. The last few days have been nuts. Lots of hours at work and lots of obligations otherwise. I have some ideas I want to write about. If life would just slow down a little now.

Yeah, if only it would slow down, LOL. It ain't gonna happen if my life is any indication.

On another note, everytime I post a comment here, it always tells me it didn't post and I have to resubmit it but it seems to always go through on the second submission.